1. Joined
    24 Oct '06
    Moves
    80
    28 Oct '06 18:53
    We are also having a "free money" tournament, $1000 to the winner, $500 for second place.

    http://www.gothicchess.com/cyborg.html

    Play 1 game each Saturday starting on November 11, 2006. Consulting allowed, programs allowed, any legal move is permitted!

    Feel free to post this link elsewhere.
  2. Joined
    02 Feb '06
    Moves
    8557
    29 Oct '06 01:021 edit
    Originally posted by EdTrice
    We are also having a "free money" tournament, $1000 to the winner, $500 for second place.

    http://www.gothicchess.com/cyborg.html

    Play 1 game each Saturday starting on November 11, 2006. Consulting allowed, programs allowed, any legal move is permitted!

    Feel free to post this link elsewhere.
    I won't play in that. Engines allowed?! Stupid, about the worst idea I've ever heard really.

    BTW:I won't make fun of you for looking for publicity if you show that girl naked. 😉
  3. Joined
    21 Feb '06
    Moves
    6830
    29 Oct '06 02:291 edit
    Hello Ed Trice.

    I admire your enthusiasm, but I fear the whole Gothic Chess idea is doomed to failure.

    One of the main reasons that people play chess is because of the history. They can look at a game played nearly 200 years ago between La Bourdonnais and MacDonnel and appreciate the brilliance of some of the moves.

    Gothic Chess has no history and, strange thought it may seem, it holds almost no interest to most classical chess players (I did a quick survey of 8 players in the pub last night, none were interested in Gothic Chess, so that proves it!). It might as well be monopoly or scrabble, it's superficial resemblence to classical chess is irrelevant because all the patterns and ideas that we are used to don't apply.

    You are also completely wrong about the anti-Fischer feeling. It is not just republicans / conservatives. I am as left wing as they come, but I detest Fischer. I've seen people moved to tears when they've read the transcript of one of his anti-Jewish radio broadcasts. In 1972 everyone knew he was mad, but it was an eccentric sort of mad and mostly harmless. He went off his trolley after 1972.

    Although, in my opinion, the vast majority of chess players will not be interested in Gothic Chess; the only people who will be interested in Gothic Chess will be chess players. I simply cannot believe that you will get even 1% of the 9000 registrations for the tournament that you forcast in an earlier post. Was this a joke? Chess players are, on the whole, very wary to part with their money, and $125 is a hell of a lot of spondoolies. Have you any idea how many Raymond Keene books I could buy with $125?

    Ok. I've written enough. As I say, I admire your enthusiasm, but I fear it is completely mis-placed.

    Good luck.
  4. Joined
    24 Oct '06
    Moves
    80
    29 Oct '06 02:512 edits
    Well, if you were correct, I would agree with you 🙂

    The 2002 college scholarship event was just for 1 year's tuition. We had 895 participants.

    In 2003 we had 1640.

    In 2004, over 2000.

    In 2005 we offered 2 years' tuition, and it was a fiasco, with over 4000 registrations, maybe 60% of the registrations coming within 1 month of the event, and people showing up "at the door" even though radio ads were mentioning the tournament was, in fact, closed.

    There were problems turning people away, let's leave it at that.

    We sold 50,000 units "b to c", business to consumer, without counting the large drop-ship sales to correctional facilities and QVC.

    We have 2200 downloads of the Gothic Vortex program every week, which generates (only) about $925/week in sales, a small percentage of registrations.

    You don't have to share my enthusiam. But the mother of the 16 year-old winner last year that is going to U Conn for free for 2 years would really, really disagree with you.
  5. Joined
    24 Oct '06
    Moves
    80
    29 Oct '06 03:021 edit
    Originally posted by cmsMaster
    I won't play in that. Engines allowed?! Stupid, about the worst idea I've ever heard really.
    Gothic Chess engines are about where chess engines were in 1983. Good, but not really that good.

    Look at all the times the SMIRF Beta program got clobbered:

    http://www.gothicchesslive.com/one-players-games.php?id=525

    And ChessV is even worse:

    http://www.gothicchesslive.com/one-players-games.php?id=275

    The problem is, with 80 squares, you can't really have an 80-bit move generator, since there are no 80-bit operating systems! Bitboard technology is still the fastest way to generate moves. So, Gothic Chess engines are slower, and nobody really has a solid understand of the explicit values of the pieces, although I tried here:

    http://www.gothicchess.com/piece_values.html

    There are only 8 Gothic Chess engines on planet earth that I know about. Here is an article about the 2004 Gothic Chess Computer World Championship

    http://www.chessville.com/GothicChess/ComputerWorldChampionships.htm
  6. Joined
    16 Sep '06
    Moves
    1363
    30 Oct '06 08:28
    Originally posted by EdTrice
    [b]Gothic Chess engines are about where chess engines were in 1983. Good, but not really that good.
    I agree. Though I was a beginner to Gothic chess, i went to your site and downloaded Gothic Vortex Copper, and I managed to beat it within a week or so, so it can't be all that good (seeing as I'm only 1600 or so with real chess...)
  7. Standard memberwargamer66
    Steve B.
    Salt Lake City
    Joined
    08 Sep '06
    Moves
    38353
    30 Oct '06 09:26
    Good luck with life coaching Fischer, that should work out well for you.

    So, is Alexis some sort of ditzy moron? Like one of those old barbie dolls that say "math is hard?" I can only assume she is because that is what the gothic chess website implies. Not very smart marketing to women, methinks.
  8. Joined
    24 Oct '06
    Moves
    80
    30 Oct '06 15:08
    Originally posted by gingerbreadman
    I agree. Though I was a beginner to Gothic chess, i went to your site and downloaded Gothic Vortex Copper, and I managed to beat it within a week or so, so it can't be all that good (seeing as I'm only 1600 or so with real chess...)
    The freeware version only does a 7-ply search though. The one that plays online hits 13 plies, has 27,000 moves in the opening book, and can announce mate in 268 since it probes the 5-piece Gothic Tablebases.

    You might find this page interesting

    http://www.gothicchess.com/javascript_endings.html
  9. Joined
    21 Apr '06
    Moves
    4211
    30 Oct '06 16:071 edit
    Originally posted by Fat Lady
    Hello Ed Trice.

    I admire your enthusiasm, but I fear the whole Gothic Chess idea is doomed to failure.

    One of the main reasons that people play chess is because of the history. They can look at a game played nearly 200 years ago between La Bourdonnais and MacDonnel and appreciate the brilliance of some of the moves.

    Gothic Chess has no history and, . As I say, I admire your enthusiasm, but I fear it is completely mis-placed.

    Good luck.
    I was reading some of the Gothic Chess forums and found quite a few posts along these lines

    "In Gothic Chess, I have taken home $1000 twice, and
    $2500 once, out of the 9 events I have played in so far.

    It's not that there is "less competition" -- it is that creativity
    takes you farther in this game. I know I am not facing a 500 year old
    opening like the Ruy Lopez, and I am really playing JUST my opponent,
    not every great master he has studied."


    It seems to me Gothic Chess will attract chess players who think they have failed at the game.....those who play for years and never improve. One might wonder if the poster of that message was just pure lazy and couldnt be bothered to learn the correct replies to the Spanish so turned to gothic chess hoping that opening theory wont be needed.

    Im not sure I really believe his claim about the prize money 🙂
  10. Joined
    03 Sep '03
    Moves
    86119
    30 Oct '06 16:23
    Originally posted by Bedlam
    "I am really playing JUST my opponent,
    not every great master he has studied."

    The funny thing about that quote is: If your opponent has studied great masters of the past and learned from them, You ARE still playing JUST your opponent. You opponent just happens to be educated.

    That player does not represent a ringing endorsement of Gothic Chess in my opinion.
  11. Joined
    21 Apr '06
    Moves
    4211
    30 Oct '06 16:241 edit
    That quote came from here...
    http://www.chessbanter.com/rec-games-chess-misc-chess/18129-more-chess-variants-print.html

    After reading through the first 5 pages it sounds as if the poster "MorphyFischer" is linked to Gothic Chess in some way, a bit like Ed posting here. Whats really intresting is the way he gets totally clobbered by the poster "Ralf Callenberg" on the 4th page then seems to stop responding to the hard questions 😛
  12. Joined
    30 Sep '06
    Moves
    1085
    30 Oct '06 16:30
    Originally posted by tmetzler
    The funny thing about that quote is: If your opponent has studied great masters of the past and learned from them, You ARE still playing JUST your opponent. You opponent just happens to be educated.

    That player does not represent a ringing endorsement of Gothic Chess in my opinion.
    I think in Gothic Chess you can still play very educated opponents, especially those that have studied classical chess in detail,
    indeed I would suggest that these may be the toughest opponents -

    of course you will have the advantage, that in Gothic Chess you will not be facing Fritz, it will be a while before the multitude of engine users migrate from sites such as this to Gothic chess
    🙂
  13. Joined
    21 Apr '06
    Moves
    4211
    30 Oct '06 16:33
    Originally posted by tmetzler
    The funny thing about that quote is: If your opponent has studied great masters of the past and learned from them, You ARE still playing JUST your opponent. You opponent just happens to be educated.

    That player does not represent a ringing endorsement of Gothic Chess in my opinion.
    Whats even better a few pages later the person really pushing Gothic Chess makes this comment

    "Gothic Chess requires much more depth than most chess players can
    appreciate, as you have demonstrated."

    😛
  14. Joined
    21 Apr '06
    Moves
    4211
    30 Oct '06 16:34
    Originally posted by Turfmoor
    I think in Gothic Chess you can still play very educated opponents, especially those that have studied classical chess in detail,
    indeed I would suggest that these may be the toughest opponents -

    of course you will have the advantage, that in Gothic Chess you will not be facing Fritz, it will be a while before the multitude of engine users migrate from sites such as this to Gothic chess
    🙂
    Its going to be years before Gothic Chess get anywhere as near as sharp as ICC or Playchess at catching cheats. 🙂
  15. Joined
    21 Apr '06
    Moves
    4211
    30 Oct '06 16:54
    Even better

    Every season, there is a tournament where the winner gets to go on a date with Alexis, the supermodel/tournament director. She flies over
    200,000 miles per year so she gets amazing flight deals and perks, so
    wherever the winner is, she goes to them.



    *Shudders*
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